It will take a war on American soil to get them to see

Iraq, she is burningGlenn Greenwald is, as I’ve said before, an incredible writer. Not a great site to bookmark if what you want is to be constantly kept abreast of recent activity, but for piercing insight there’s none that can top him. Today’s column is just as true as his others, tackling a question that I feel most aren’t willing to genuinely answer: “Why do they hate us?”

Note, too, the vast gap between how Americans perceive of their actions (mere “aberrations”) and how so much of the rest of the world perceives of it, especially those in the targeted regions.  So much of this disparity is explained by a basic lack of empathy:  imagine if every American spent just a day contemplating how they’d react if some foreign army from a Muslim nation invaded and bombed the U.S., occupied the country for the next several years with 60,000 soldiers, killed tens of thousands of citizens here, set up secret prisons where they disappeared Americans for years without charges or even contact with the outside world, imposed sanctions that blockaded food and medicine and killed countless children, invaded and ransacked our homes at will, abducted Americans and shipped them halfway around the world to island-prisons, instituted a worldwide torture regime, armed their allies for attacks on other Western nations, and threatened still other invasions.

The United States is a nation that is, for the most part, untainted by war. The last time American citizens had to worry themselves about seeing soldiers from an opposing military in their back yard, they were still Americans holding the guns. Our brothers fought in Iraq, our fathers fought in Vietnam, our grandfathers fought in Germany, and our great grandfathers fought in Germany.

Say the word “war” to an American and the word is subconsciously prefixed with “sending them off to.” War is an external event to Americans, we think of our men and women fighting and, from our perspective, it’s more about watching them get on a plane and counting down the days until they come back. War affects our lives in a tangential way; we know someone who’s fighting or we watch our economy ebb and flow.

Even the notion of war on our soil baffles us. We can’t imagine it, and this manifests in the inability to understand why in the world those ungrateful Arabs aren’t singing our praises. Americans have absolutely no concept of what it is to have a war happen on their own soil, and I don’t think outside of it actually happening that they ever will.

To get at least somewhat of an idea, I want you to engage in a little exercise. If you’re near a window, look outside. Just look out there. Chances are you see your street as at least somewhat safe. Maybe there are some criminals, but you’re largely safe. This is your home. Maybe there are some kids riding bikes, someone walking a dog.

Now visualize, to the best of your ability, the house across the street from yours (or whatever’s over there), exploding. Just blowing the fuck up in a cloud of dust, debris, and body parts. Your floor quakes, a few things fall off the shelves, and your neighbors are dead. A plane flies by, the one that dropped the bomb. On the street, men in uniform with patches of flags from another country swarm in, checking the wreckage. They cart off the survivors, and they leave. The next day, a news report says the people in that home were suspected of insurgency. Friends of yours. And you know they weren’t.

Take a moment to think about what that would feel like. The fear. Worse yet, the anger. The rage at seeing soldiers from some other country kill and capture your friends, with no warning. Knowing it may happen again, and there’s nothing you can do it about it.

This is us. The war isn’t limited to Arabian warzones. It’s in their streets, in their yards, killing their families. No matter how noble our intentions were, we stormed into their neighborhoods, told them what we wanted, and are now apparently unable to comprehend why so many of them are dropping land mines in front of our vehicles.

Actually, I have a better idea. Scrap all that stuff above. Just go watch Red Dawn, and realize that, to the Middle Eastern citizens, we’re the Soviets. We’re dropping in and devastating their towns all in our interests, with little to no concern for theirs. That’s the answer to “why do they hate us?” It has nothing to do with freedoms, with religion, with race, with our approaches to anything. It has to do with what we’ve done to them. America isn’t the only free nation, and yet somehow they aren’t furious at the Germans or the Norwegians.

Americans are not known for our empathy (just check out the health care debate), and this is a case where, beyond being actually confronted with the horrors we’re inflicting on the people they’re claiming should be “grateful”, I can’t see it being fixed.

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  • Rechan

    That addresses as far as Iraq post-2003..

    It doesn't explain the attitudes in all the other Middle East countries (or non-ME countries for that matter).

    It doesn't explain "Death to America" in Iran, and it doesn't explain the reports of "muslims dancing in the streets" on 9/11.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

      Really? So you think if China invaded Mexico and Canada the United States wouldn't be losing their minds? Keep in mind the area of the Middle East isn't exactly that different from the US itself. It'd be like if you lived in Maryland and North Korea bombed West Virginia.

      As for the "muslims dancing in the streets", ignoring how overblown a lot of those reports were (if you'll recall Iran supported us back then), remember that the reason Al Qaeda and the Taliban formed was in large part due to American foreign policy in the 1980's.

  • Rechan

    That addresses as far as Iraq post-2003..

    It doesn't explain the attitudes in all the other Middle East countries (or non-ME countries for that matter).

    It doesn't explain "Death to America" in Iran, and it doesn't explain the reports of "muslims dancing in the streets" on 9/11.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

      Really? So you think if China invaded Mexico and Canada the United States wouldn't be losing their minds? Keep in mind the area of the Middle East isn't exactly that different from the US itself. It'd be like if you lived in Maryland and North Korea bombed West Virginia.

      As for the "muslims dancing in the streets", ignoring how overblown a lot of those reports were (if you'll recall Iran supported us back then), remember that the reason Al Qaeda and the Taliban formed was in large part due to American foreign policy in the 1980's.

  • MelaneeM

    True enough, Hanlon! Here in California we were HYSTERICAL when New York was hit, even though California was completely untouched. Traditionally Californians and New Yorkers have VERY little in common and don't particularly understand each other, anyway. But the truth is that for a very short period of time, the entire country saw the attack on New York as an attack on all of us. And we all hated the attackers… as an American WHOLE. The people who hate us now in the ME and elsewhere must feel that same comradery that we had – whether they’ve been personally attacked or not.

  • MelaneeM

    True enough, Hanlon! Here in California we were HYSTERICAL when New York was hit, even though California was completely untouched. Traditionally Californians and New Yorkers have VERY little in common and don't particularly understand each other, anyway. But the truth is that for a very short period of time, the entire country saw the attack on New York as an attack on all of us. And we all hated the attackers… as an American WHOLE. The people who hate us now in the ME and elsewhere must feel that same comradery that we had – whether they’ve been personally attacked or not.

  • Keth

    I have Red Dawn; ever since I first saw it as a kid I have loved it.

    But it's also a perfect example of what you said; picture America being invaded by outsiders, screwing with your country and killing your people. There would be a total uprising/freakout. Only Red Dawn has ever done this; I can't – offhand – think of any other film that has the idea of the US being invaded, it's always the US doing the invading (although if I'm wrong, please correct me).

    Why is it there is such this… "You can't attack us, we're the US" feeling? I think that's one reason why 9/11 *was* so successful; outside of Japan al Queda were the first to take "it" to the US in person in such a major way.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

      It ties into that "American Exceptionalism" notion that gets touted as a virtue and not a serious problem. Those who view the American enterprise as inherently flawless are the ones that get us into these problems. The nation is capable of screwing up just as much as it is of doing good, but parading around doing whatever we want with a "don't bitch at us, we're Americans, that means we're doing God's work!" is a surefire way to keep Al Qaeda's quotas better full than our own military's.

    • Brandon

      I honestly dont even think Al Queda did what bush said they did on 9/11 an i’m an American. I honestly think Bush did it because he wanted to try and follow in daddies foot steps and go take Oil. Now he’s fucked us all over and everyone hates America.

  • Keth

    I think you're right about the empathy, too; there seems to be a lack of it in a lot of people in the US, and yet it's expected the rest of the world have empathy for the US if something bad happens to them (even though that happens, too).

    "It has nothing to do with freedoms, with religion, with race, with our approaches to anything. It has to do with what we’ve done to them."

    Exactly.

  • Keth

    I have Red Dawn; ever since I first saw it as a kid I have loved it.

    But it's also a perfect example of what you said; picture America being invaded by outsiders, screwing with your country and killing your people. There would be a total uprising/freakout. Only Red Dawn has ever done this; I can't – offhand – think of any other film that has the idea of the US being invaded, it's always the US doing the invading (although if I'm wrong, please correct me).

    Why is it there is such this… "You can't attack us, we're the US" feeling? I think that's one reason why 9/11 *was* so successful; outside of Japan al Queda were the first to take "it" to the US in person in such a major way.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

      It ties into that "American Exceptionalism" notion that gets touted as a virtue and not a serious problem. Those who view the American enterprise as inherently flawless are the ones that get us into these problems. The nation is capable of screwing up just as much as it is of doing good, but parading around doing whatever we want with a "don't bitch at us, we're Americans, that means we're doing God's work!" is a surefire way to keep Al Qaeda's quotas better full than our own military's.

  • Keth

    I think you're right about the empathy, too; there seems to be a lack of it in a lot of people in the US, and yet it's expected the rest of the world have empathy for the US if something bad happens to them (even though that happens, too).

    "It has nothing to do with freedoms, with religion, with race, with our approaches to anything. It has to do with what we’ve done to them."

    Exactly.

  • greg

    The USA will be invaded by ten nations under seven commands after a nuclear exchange takes place.Along with military targets 279 populated area of the USA will suffer nuclear devastation.After about seven months time Russia,Belaru, and Ukraine soldiers along with Serbians in the New England areas and Nicaraguans and Cubans in the Florida to Alabama areas numbering 3.43 million will be in occupation at wars end after losing a total of 11.34 million.In the west Chinese and Japanese troops will number 6.29 million at wars end after losing a whopping 24.45 million.Foreign soldiers will lose a lot due to weather,supply lines being choked off dirty tactics of smart Americans who lose half nationwide at 14.10 at wars end. Especially in the west with very little military available citizens will come out in high numbers with their own guns to kill the invaders but they over time still advance towards the central part of the USA.Further inland paratroopers also land but not enough so the enemy relies on coastal infusions from the coasts to supplement existing enemy forces. The USA will be defeated! 107.20 million Former American citizens will still be alive at that time.Peak populaton in 2009 stands at 303 million.

    • PaulM

      Nice. Hey, what are the winning Lotto numbers for next week?

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

        I've been banking on 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42 for a while now. Still no go.

  • greg

    The USA will be invaded by ten nations under seven commands after a nuclear exchange takes place.Along with military targets 279 populated area of the USA will suffer nuclear devastation.After about seven months time Russia,Belaru, and Ukraine soldiers along with Serbians in the New England areas and Nicaraguans and Cubans in the Florida to Alabama areas numbering 3.43 million will be in occupation at wars end after losing a total of 11.34 million.In the west Chinese and Japanese troops will number 6.29 million at wars end after losing a whopping 24.45 million.Foreign soldiers will lose a lot due to weather,supply lines being choked off dirty tactics of smart Americans who lose half nationwide at 14.10 at wars end. Especially in the west with very little military available citizens will come out in high numbers with their own guns to kill the invaders but they over time still advance towards the central part of the USA.Further inland paratroopers also land but not enough so the enemy relies on coastal infusions from the coasts to supplement existing enemy forces. The USA will be defeated! 107.20 million Former American citizens will still be alive at that time.Peak populaton in 2009 stands at 303 million.

    • PaulM

      Nice. Hey, what are the winning Lotto numbers for next week?

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Hanlon Hanlon

        I've been banking on 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42 for a while now. Still no go.

  • greg

    After the world economy goes down hard in early summer Russia will invade Europe for three days but the USA will wipe them out by airplanes dropping charges down onto them.Shortly later China and Russia bombs the USA and gets retaliated back upon.This leaves over 12 million Russians homeless.The same year great famine hits the area of Pakistan throughout southern China.China's population after the USA strikes with 768 nuclear warheads-44 nillion die the famine further reduces the population down to 480 million.India loses all but 150 million persons.They get hit the hardest from famine.

  • greg

    After the world economy goes down hard in early summer Russia will invade Europe for three days but the USA will wipe them out by airplanes dropping charges down onto them.Shortly later China and Russia bombs the USA and gets retaliated back upon.This leaves over 12 million Russians homeless.The same year great famine hits the area of Pakistan throughout southern China.China's population after the USA strikes with 768 nuclear warheads-44 nillion die the famine further reduces the population down to 480 million.India loses all but 150 million persons.They get hit the hardest from famine.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Dormilona Dormilona

    The winning numbers are encoded in Greg's last post: 3, 6, 7, 6, 8 12, 44. Wait till the jackpot hits $480 million. Then place your bet. There will be three winners (me, Paul, and Hanlon). We will each win $150 million. This will be just enough to buy a health insurance policy and a loaf of bread to stave off famine.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Dormilona Dormilona

    The winning numbers are encoded in Greg's last post: 3, 6, 7, 6, 8 12, 44. Wait till the jackpot hits $480 million. Then place your bet. There will be three winners (me, Paul, and Hanlon). We will each win $150 million. This will be just enough to buy a health insurance policy and a loaf of bread to stave off famine.

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